Ask the Developer Vol. 13, The Legend of Zelda: Echoes of Wisdom — Part 4 – News – Nintendo Official Site

• This article has been translated from the original Japanese content.

• Some of the images and videos shown in text were created during development.

In this thirteenth volume of Ask the Developer, an interview series in which Nintendo developers convey in their own words Nintendo’s thoughts about creating products and the specific points they are particular about, we’re talking to the developers behind The Legend of Zelda™: Echoes of Wisdom game for the Nintendo Switch™ system, which launches on Thursday, September 26.

This is the first game where Princess Zelda is the main character, there’s the echoes gameplay, and the kingdom of Hyrule looks a bit different from before too… The newness of it all really stands out. Does this mean that the world and the enemies you fight are also different?

Sano: While echoes – in other words, using multiple items to solve puzzles – make up the main gameplay in Princess Zelda’s adventure, we’ve kept the familiar dungeons and boss fights from the series in a way that still gives you that authentic “Legend of Zelda-like” feeling.

Aonuma: Designing dungeons is Grezzo’s speciality. Grezzo has been researching the Legend of Zelda series for a long while now, through their works on the remakes. As such, they suggested a series of ideas that made me think, “Ah, that’s a new angle!” Some of their staff have been playing the series since they were little, and I was just so excited to see what kinds of ideas they had and what they thought a Legend of Zelda dungeon should be like.

Terada: Yeah, we’ve been involved since The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time remake, so everyone has great respect for the series. Many of the staff love it and have played the games many times over. So even now, when making a new top-down game in the series, we’re always thinking about how we can bring that “Legend of Zelda-like” feeling to the game. However, we packed in so many things we wanted to do to create this “Legend of Zelda-like” feeling, and the map ended up eight times the size of The Legend of Zelda: Link’s Awakening. (Laughs)

Eight times the size?! That’s pretty extensive.

Aonuma: At first it was four times the size, but then, before we knew it… (Laughs) However, although the map has become much larger, the feeling of a top-down Legend of Zelda game, where you can easily enjoy gameplay in a compact world, is still there, so it isn’t intimidating to explore. So, you’ll be able to play with a slightly different feeling compared to the vast worlds of The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild or The Legend of Zelda: Tears of the Kingdom.

Speaking of a “Legend of Zelda-like” feeling, boss battles are also a key feature of the series, aren’t they? What are the boss battles like in this game?

Terada: Your individual personality really comes out in how you choose to use echoes in boss battles. For example, there’s a snake-like echo called Rope, and it’s possible to create a large number of Rope echoes at once. Some people like to create a swarm of Ropes and use them to attack endlessly while they stay on the defensive. There are other people who like to use Moblins holding a shield as a decoy while they sneak up on the enemy from behind in swordfighter form. Also, you can recover health by resting in a bed. There are some people who leave fighting bosses to the strong echoes while they make an echo of a bed and sleep soundly through the battle. (Laughs)

Aonuma: I don’t think there are any other games where the player character can have a nice, peaceful sleep in bed in the middle of a boss fight. (Laughs)

Sano: But sometimes you might think that you have a chance to sleep and then actually get hit while sleeping and end up in a bad situation. (Laughs)

Aonuma: Past games always had health recovery items in front of the door to a boss fight, but in this game, you can rest in bed instead. (Laughs)

I see, so there are countless different strategies depending on how you use echoes.

Aonuma: I’ve actually played through this game eight times already, and there is one technique that I only discovered on my eighth playthrough. If there’s a lot of distance between an enemy and your echo, then it can be hard for the echo to attack effectively. So, what you do is you bind the enemy and move it closer to the echo that you copied. This way, your echo can attack much more effectively, making your life easier. (Laughs)

Aonuma: But sometimes, other enemies notice and try to attack me. So, you have to be careful about that. (Laughs) As I play through this game again and again, I keep wanting to try methods and techniques other than those I had previously thought were the “correct” ones. I’ve even started to feel that if I haven’t found my own personal methods and techniques, then maybe I haven’t uncovered the real appeal of the game yet.

Sano: Speaking of binding, I love binding enemies and making them fall down pits. (Laughs)

Aonuma: Ah, that’s a dirty trick. (Laughs)

Sano: We talked about covering up pits because this indeed seemed rather dirty, but when I actually tried it, it wasn’t so easy to pull off, and I ended up accidentally falling down the pit instead. (Laughs)

Aonuma: But when that happens, you don’t feel frustrated; rather, it’s funny, and you can laugh at your mistake. Thinking, “Well, OK, that’s fair.” (Laughs)

Sano: It really made me appreciate how important this kind of game design is, where players are actually able to do the things that they come up with.

Aonuma: This kind of freedom is also a key part of the “Legend of Zelda-like” feeling found in recent entries in the series.

I think that players who played The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild and The Legend of Zelda: Tears of the Kingdom also think of gameplay that provides this level of freedom as having that “Legend of Zelda-like” feeling.

Aonuma: Speaking of that “Legend of Zelda-like” feeling, creation of the sound starts later in development, and for this game, it really helped increase that feeling at the end of development. Earlier in development, we spent a long time making the game without any sound implemented. But then, toward the end, as we started mass production of data and shifted the work to move toward the final product, the sound team came to us saying, “Here’s what the main theme sounds like,” and had us listen. And it was just like, “Wow, this is it!” It’s like you’re pulled right into the world of the Legend of Zelda… It’s amazing how much difference there is between having music and not having any. The sound team has spent many years working on the Legend of Zelda series, so I guess you can say there is a certain “Legend of Zelda-like” feeling ingrained in the audio too.

Indeed, the somewhat familiar melody line and how the instruments are used feels like it helps bring back the experiences of playing past games. And I felt it also matches well with this toy-box-like presentation of the world.

Aonuma: For me, it’s when you enter Suthorn Prairie from Suthorn Beach, and the main theme starts playing. That part really got me.

Sano: The moment you leave the cave and that theme starts playing, that’s the first time you hear it in the game. I feel like that scene was really created to resonate with the player’s feelings. You don’t know where it is that you’ve arrived, but you get the feeling that the real adventure is about to start.

Aonuma: The sound team takes the near-finished game, and while imagining how players would feel in each scene, they compose music to fit those scenes and have it play each part at exactly the right moment. And I didn’t notice this in the beginning because I was too busy with the gameplay, but on my sixth, seventh, or eighth playthrough of this game, I was relaxed enough to make pleasant discoveries like, “Oh, so this music plays in this scene!” (Laughs)

Sano: You’re enjoying the game more than anyone else. (Laughs)

Aonuma: You know, that final scene…

Terada: Oh yeah, I know what you mean. (Laughs)

Sano: You can’t talk about that here! (Laughs)

Aonuma: I know, I know. (Laughs) But I felt the power of music was so strong, it nearly brought me to tears. As the music played, I thought, “Wow, that’s good.” It was really moving. Agh, I’ve got to play it through again now.

I see. It’s not just the story and gameplay that create that “Legend of Zelda-like” feeling, but many other elements all coming together, including music and sound effects. To finish up, could each of you say a few words on your hopes for how people will play this game?

Terada: I think this Legend of Zelda game is one that’s approachable even for people who don’t play games very often. With previous Legend of Zelda games you had to fight enemies yourself with your sword. People who aren’t so good at action games might have felt that it was too difficult for them. However, with this game, you can play using echoes and try out lots of different things. So, I think it’s enjoyable even for players who usually struggle with more demanding action gameplay. Also, just like Aonuma-san playing through it eight times, your experience changes every time you play this game. The gameplay changes depending on which path you take and when you get each echo. So I think there can always be new discoveries even if you play it multiple times. I hope that players will play the game over and over and make more and more discoveries.

Thank you very much. Sano-san, please go ahead.

Sano: Um, well I had been planning to talk about the music at the end…

Aonuma: Oh, you wanted to talk about it. Sorry. (Laughs)

Sano: No worries. (Laughs) Well then, since Terada-san made a comment for beginners, I’ll make a comment for fans of the Legend of Zelda series. In this game, you play as Princess Zelda, who wouldn’t usually attack enemies, but she can eventually attack directly by borrowing Link’s sword. We’ve also made it so that attacking enemies with echoes is just as satisfying as defeating enemies with the sword.

So please don’t worry too much about not being able to attack by yourself. I think you should be able to enjoy the same kind of thrill and excitement as other games in the Legend of Zelda series. Also, The Legend of Zelda: Link’s Awakening was set on a single island, but in this game, you get to explore a variety of different places in Hyrule. There are Gerudo, Gorons, and Deku Scrubs, who we haven’t seen for a while. As many may know, the world of Hyrule is home to many different cultural regions, and the diverse graphics for each of their regions that Grezzo has crafted with love are really something to see. So, I hope you’ll keep an eye out for this.

Then last but not least, Aonuma-san, please share your thoughts.

Aonuma: Until now, the 2D top-down Legend of Zelda games haven’t seen that many major transformations. When we were developing the remake for The Legend of Zelda: Link’s Awakening, I was thinking about what I’d like to do in the next one, but I was wondering how far Grezzo would be able to go. But with Terada-san taking the lead for this title, the staff at Grezzo approached it with fresh perspectives and free thinking. They really pulled it all together. And additionally, Sano-san, who has worked with Grezzo for many years on the Legend of Zelda series, led the project, bringing that authentic “Legend of Zelda-like” feeling. As a producer, it felt like watching your child grow up. I’m really grateful for all the hard work. I hope lots of people will enjoy this new top-down Legend of Zelda and will be excited for future top-down Legend of Zelda games too.

I’m looking forward myself to playing this new Legend of Zelda game where, for the first time, Princess Zelda is the playable main character. And to making new discoveries every time I play. And I’m also excited to see what the future holds for top-down Legend of Zelda games. Thank you very much.